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Travel Warning Ahead

Travel Warning Ahead

Episode #65  |  December 9th, 2021
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In This Episode:

As the world reacts to the Omicron variant, airlines are bracing for yet another turbulent time… And according to Ben Baldanza, economist and former CEO of Spirit Airlines, the industry is currently undergoing a massive change. 

Legacy airlines are struggling with high oil prices, significant travel restrictions, and a total loss of the business class customers… But that doesn’t mean there aren’t investing opportunities in this space as companies like JetBlue, Spirit, and Frontier become more focused on regional travel. The smart money, Ben tells Trish, will be re-thinking how it can invest in the airline sector…

 Plus, this former airline CEO details exactly when you should buy your plane tickets to secure the cheapest rates, and how purchasing a package is often the ultimate deal. 

 Join Trish and Ben for an in-depth discussion about the changes ahead for the airline industry.

Guests:

Ben Baldanza

Economist and former CEO of Spirit Airlines
Ben Baldanza has a 35-year career in the US Airline industry. For eleven years, he was the CEO of Spirit Airlines, helping to transform that airline into the first "ultra low cost" carrier in North America.

Transcript:

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People are getting nervous, the travel industry is starting to shut down, and it’s all happening right before Christmas. Hello, everyone. Welcome to this week’s edition of American Consequences. I am Trish Regan. It’s very good to have you here. We have a lot going on. We have a new variant that is really causing concern among so many people especially within the travel industry, the leisure industry.

These industries that have just started to see a light at the end of the tunnel. These industries that were starting to be revamped and revive themselves are now in jeopardy of seeing a lot more hiccups down the road, and this may just be the new norm. Right? We may just have to learn to live with variants coming forth every six months… every year… some are tougher than others. 

It may be that we find ourselves in a world where the Modernas, the Pfizers, the Johnson & Johnsons that can come up with these new vaccines every year are going to be incredibly critical and we’re going to have to treat the coronavirus vaccine similar to you might treat the flu vaccine, where you get the new updated one every single year. This is the challenge. We can deal with that somewhat on a domestic level.

The question is, what happens internationally? Do we become a more protectionist kind of world where borders become that much more important? I would argue that that is likely to happen. Consider that KLM flight that went from South Africa into the Netherlands, and upon landing, they discovered that 61 people of the 600 on board tested positive for COVID, 13 of which tested positive for Omicron, the new variant. So that tells you that we run these certain risks anytime you got a flight coming from one country into another.

I mean, I think it’s a little different when you’re talking about the United States of America. We are a country after all, so you can’t start talking about state to state and county to county. We have to recognize that we’re one big giant place and that we need to fight this all together. But when you consider, say, the U.S. versus Europe or the U.S. versus U.K., U.S. versus Canada, U.S. versus China, I would anticipate that we are going to have more barriers in terms of people coming here and there will be more barriers in terms of us going there. And that may just be the new world in which we live. But how do you think about that as an investor in airlines or leisure companies right now?

I do think that we will manage through this. We’ve done it before. Certainly with the first version of COVID and then the Delta variant that came out, we have managed to keep persevering, we have stayed open now as a country, as an economy, and I think that that’s important, critical to do. Yet one could anticipate a real change in travel as we know it. Look, we’ve already seen it because people don’t need to go places as much anymore for business anyway, you can do just exactly what you want by remote.

You don’t actually have to get on the plane and the company doesn’t have to spend all that money to send you to Timbuktu. So there’s been a lot of changes, there will continue to be changes, but the new cycle right now of the new variant will likely speed those up. So, how do you think about investing in travel? And by the way, for fun, we just also have to talk about how the heck do you get the best prices on tickets?

For anybody who’s trying to travel this Christmas, we’re going to tell you exactly how you do that because we have Ben Baldanza here with us today. He was the president of Spirit Airlines in 2005, became CEO in 2006, held the position for 10 years. He is credited with leading the airline to profitability. And his view of the world right now is that there will be, as I said, so much change in this industry. So how can you be poised to recognize it ahead of everyone else? I’m so happy to have with you Ben Baldanza today on the program. Welcome, sir.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, it’s great to be with you, Trish. I’m happy to be here.

 

Trish Regan:               It’s tough for this industry. Just when they think that they’re starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel, up pops another variant. And I would anticipate that this may be the new way of the world. I wonder if every year, we’re going to suddenly be confronted with these new variants and you’re going to have to have a scramble for new and improved vaccines, similar to what we deal with the flu every year. But how does that affect the travel industry?

 

Ben Baldanza:            It’s a great question Trish, and as a world we’re learning how to deal with this. Like you said, just like the flu has new variants every year and we get a flu shot every year for what is hopefully related to that current variant, it looks like this COVID virus continues to mutate in the same way. I find it interesting, for example, that the Delta variant emerged in India when India had a low vaccination rate. Now India has over 70% vaccinated, and this Omicron variant originated in Africa in an area that also has very low vaccination rates.

So it seems where it’s easiest to mutate, it does. And then it also seems like then the world freaks out, if you will, and says, “Oh, no, what does this mean? We don’t know how infectious it is, we don’t know if the current vaccines will protect us.” And I think as a world we tend to overreact in a way and that is very penalizing to the airline business because governments shut down and people get skittish about whether they should fly or take a trip. And I’m not saying that people should ignore these things, of course, we need to be safe. I’m fully vaccinated and I support vaccinations.

But we have to recognize that we’re not going to beat COVID, we’re going to learn to live with COVID. And living with COVID means there’s going to be continual changes to it, and we need boosters now and may continue to need boosters going forward. And if we keep shutting down government borders, and if we keep trying to penalize the whole economy for what is essentially a virus that’s going around the world, it seems to me that that’s bad public policy also.

The way the airlines are going to have to deal with this, is probably to continue to enforce onboard mask mandates, continue to recognize that businesses are going to be the ones who cut back more travel than leisure customers. That has a lot of implications for the industry. But I think the industry will get through this because I think every variant, we learn more and more about how to deal with it.

 

Trish Regan:               Sure. I think you said a few things in there which I actually wrote down as you were saying. We’re not going to beat COVID, we’re going to learn to live with it, I think that’s quite true. But I wonder if learning to live with it encourages a kind of protectionism that will be costly in some ways for the world economy, certainly from a travel perspective.

You mentioned that the airlines need to learn to adapt. I wonder, there was the flight that went from South Africa into the Netherlands and apparently over 60 people on board had contracted this new Omicron virus and it seemed like a really, really high amount on that one particular flight. I just questioned, do you think that not all airlines are checking or asking for COVID tests within a 48-hour window? Do they need to do that? Do we need instant tests before you get on an airline?

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, that’s an interesting idea. I think that there’s a lot of fraud that could happen in that too. You could present somebody, you could present a fake test potentially, that would be a mean thing to do and a terrible thing to do. I heard about that flight from South Africa to the Netherlands, and quite honestly, I’m dubious that 60 people contracted it on the plane versus 60 people had it when they boarded the plane.

Those are two different things. Science has proven that it’s tough to contract the virus on an airplane, not impossible but tough. The air is recycled every couple of minutes, the air flows vertically up and down, not across. So if someone two rows behind you coughs, those droplets don’t get to you, they’re pushed to the ground. Everyone on the plane is wearing a mask. You’re looking at a seat in front of you, not in another person’s face. So for all those reasons, I question whether it’s really likely. I believe 60 people who got off the plane had the virus, but I don’t believe that all 60 of them contracted it on the plane. I bet that most, if not all, had it when they boarded.

 

Trish Regan:               Yeah, and people have made that point over and over again. But it seems we as a society, we want to be as open as we can. We want to be able to travel places and go anywhere we want. But there is the reality of once you travel to another place, to another country, if you are infected you’re bringing that infection with you… which is tough for that country because now Netherlands is dealing with this, and the concern is that more and more people most likely have it within the Netherlands.

So, I don’t know what the answer is. This was a KLM flight, I believe, from Johannesburg that arrived on Friday morning and there were 600 passengers on board. They were held for several hours while being tested for the virus, and ultimately I believe 61 did test positive, 13 of them had the Omicron. But I’m just wondering why they weren’t tested, and maybe they were and maybe the tests were not accurate initially before leaving their country. How would you be responding right now? If you were still running Spirit or if you were running at a big international carrier like a KLM or any international airline, how would you deal with this Ben?

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, it’s a great question and I think requiring a test before you board is probably a fair thing for international flights. I don’t think that should be required domestically within the U.S., and other countries could decide for themselves whether they would require it domestically. But when you’re crossing international borders, I think it’s fair to say, “Prove to the country you’re going to that you’re not bringing a virus with you or that you’re not infected with a virus when you board.”

So I think that’s a fair thing to ask. I think that would have to be a quick test. It would have to be available in the airport so people when they check-in would have time to take the test and get a result before they board. Without that, it’s going to be very difficult and would really crimp travel.

 

Trish Regan:               Ben, can’t you just see it right now? And I can, but it’s like TSA was bad enough, now you’re going to have to deal with the COVID test in the airport. People are going to say, “Is it worth it? Do I really want to go to Europe this summer on vacation? I get it, stay in this long line, I get to deal with TSA nonsense, and I got to get a test while I’m there.”

 

Ben Baldanza:            I wouldn’t say it has to be done in the airport. Certainly, I would allow people to bring in a test if they could do it. But I would say if you get there and your head was in the sand, you knew, you had no idea you needed the test, rather than not being able to take the flight, you’d be able to take the test.

 

Trish Regan:               Yeah, no, I hear you. Look, I think we agree on this. I guess this gets me into the next leg of our conversation, which is that ultimately, I think that the airlines that have the best customer service will really be rewarded. But I don’t know if the economics are there, I don’t know if the economics really makes sense. I do not like traveling anymore. I really don’t like having to go to the airport. And look, I’ve got the whole clear thing and I’m usually upfront in the plane, but it’s still just kind of miserable experience.

And, you know, if you’re in the way back in the middle seat and you’ve had to wait two and a half hours in line, it’s like, “Why?” If I can get in my car and go somewhere, I’d be more likely to. So, I just wonder how this industry, which by the way doesn’t have as many business travelers either anymore, I mean, people I know that used to be on planes three times a week traveling internationally in business class, they don’t have that revenue with these airlines anymore.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Right now, still most of the travel that is on airplanes is leisure travel. That’s always been true, leisure travel has always been a bigger volume of travelers. And business travel is “stop and go.” It started coming back with some conventions earlier, then the Omicron comes and all of a sudden people are back to Zoom. We all remember that a lot of companies set September 1 as a “return to office” date, then Delta came and they’ve all pushed that back and into 2022. So the business world is figuring out how to do business with less airline travel, and I personally believe that some business travel is gone forever.

I believe that (with) just natural growth of the economy in the world there will be more business travelers that fly someday then flew in 2019. But it’s going to be under that amount for a long time because people are just changing their view of what’s important for business travel and how valuable things like video and things can be to make business happen. The world’s been working that way for almost two years, so all the chief financial officers out there are saying, “Why are we spending all this money to send our people on these visits where you have to pay hotel, and meals, and expensive flights and they can just do it by Microsoft Teams and we save a lot of money?” So I see that changing. That has enormous implications for the industry, Trish, in terms of how they configure their plane, how many flights they fly, how the loyalty programs work, and all kinds of ways.

 

Trish Regan:               I get you. I hear you. So that actually would make a Spirit-type airline, an airline that’s just dedicated to leisure travel, more interesting in this environment for investors versus the bigger legacy carriers which are no longer going to have that business coming from the jet setting international set that was flying here, there, and everywhere for meetings.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, you’re right and you’ve already seen that in a couple of ways. Both Frontier Airlines and Sun Country Airlines went public in the last year during the COVID environment. And so, investors supported those airlines going public because they are all leisure-focused, low-cost airlines. Also, two new airlines in the U.S. started this year, David Newman’s Breeze Airways and Andrew Levy’s Avelo. And those are both low-cost, leisure-focused airlines, and investors funded both of those startups.

So when you have new airlines starting, and airlines going public, there are investors out there who are voting with their feet and saying, “These are the kinds of airlines that we believe are long term sustainable.” Because while a business meeting might be happy going to Microsoft Teams, you’re not going go to a wedding that way, or your grandmother’s 70th birthday party that way.

 

Trish Regan:               Right. So, it means tough times ahead for people like me who don’t really like to travel to begin with, maybe, I mean, I don’t know. Look, if somebody can do this right, and I think that there have been airlines, I think JetBlue is a great example of an airline that’s really gotten this right. If you can get that customer service right, I think that that’s just a game changer. But there’s a lot of headwinds. Oil prices, which we haven’t even talked about.

Oil, as much as the administration is trying to manage this and tapping the SPR, et cetera, it seems to be having a reverse effect. We’ll see if Omicron really brings it down considerably. But there’s a lot of headwinds for oil prices right now, and a lot of people predicting upwards of $100 a barrel. That again is taking profitability, is it not, away from these airlines?

 

Ben Baldanza:            It absolutely is. And that again, as weird as this is to say, in some ways that’s a good thing for the low-cost airlines because when everybody’s paying more for their ticket, the value proposition of the low-cost airline looks even better. If I could pay, for example, $70 on Spirit but get a flight at the same time on Delta for only $90, I might say, “20 bucks I’ll take that difference,” and fly what I think is maybe a nicer airline to fly. But at now if my choice is on Spirit for $100 and Delta is $300, you say, “Look, I’ll just take the differences on Spirit and save the money.” And so the higher price is going – You saw that, when oil went up to $147 a barrel back in the late 2000s.

What you saw is a lot of the industry go into bankruptcy, and you saw the lowest cost airlines, including Spirit, actually make money that year because a lot of people bought down to the low price. Fewer people travel but a bigger percentage of them pick the low-cost airline.

 

Trish Regan:               We’re talking with Ben Baldanza he was the chief executive officer of Spirit Airlines from 2005 to 2016. So he knows a thing or two about this entire industry. You also have a podcast, do you not?

 

Ben Baldanza:            Yes, the podcast is called Airlines Confidential – Airlines, plural, Confidential. It’s a weekly podcast, it’s about 35 to 40 minutes long. We talk about things going on in the industry, we interview guests from the industry, and we do a funny thing called “Fine or Whine” every week where we read a customer complaint and we arbitrate whether the customer or the airline has the stronger position in the case.

 

Trish Regan:               The other thing I wanted to ask you about so your company is called Diemacher LLC, which actually is a German name, and I believe was it a strategy board game?

 

Ben Baldanza:            That’s exactly right. It’s a board game from the 1990s, actually maybe even earlier, the 1980s. And it’s a game about elections, it’s an election game. But within the geeky board-gaming world it’s a famous game because it was very innovative for its time and it’s still very fun to play today. And it’s a game that I particularly enjoyed so when I decided to start my company, I named my company after that board game.

 

Trish Regan:               Interesting. How did you wind up getting into the airline business, to begin with? Because again, if I’m recalling correctly, I believe you were an economist to start out. You went to some really good schools, you got an economics degree from Princeton, and then somehow wound up running this airline, how did that transition occur?

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, airlines are always looking for good people. And I’m not saying I’m one of them, but I’m saying they’re always looking for good people.

 

And the best place to go work in an airline if you want to work in management, now if you want to be a pilot, that’s a different thing, if you want be a mechanic, that’s a different thing, or a flight attendant, but if you want to work in management in an airline and maybe become the CEO of an airline someday, the best place to start would be in the finance department because airline finance departments are real important in terms of how they finance expensive airplanes, manage cash flow, and measure profitability and such.

Also, another great place to start is in the pricing and revenue management group. Those are very dynamic areas in an airline, everybody knows how crazy airline pricing is and how often it changes. So those are very active, decision-oriented parts of the business. Or maybe in IT, the industry is changing in lots of ways with technology and finding ways for customers to sell service more.

So, if you’re good with data or you’re quantitatively strong and like the idea of making a lot of decisions, or you have a finance mind, the airlines will want to hire you, and you can start a career the way I did a long time ago and maybe be a CEO someday.

 

Trish Regan:               That was you. Where did you start? Which airline?

 

Ben Baldanza:            I started in the finance department in American Airlines in 1986.

 

Trish Regan:               That’s great.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Yes. And at the time, American was led by Bob Crandall who was a strong finance guy. So he expected his finance department to be involved in all the key decisions of the company.

So working in finance, just out of college, at American, I was able to get involved with things like fleet planning and labor analysis and profitability measurement of new routes and things like that. And it was a fascinating place to be. And I was there at the same time as many other people who have gone on to successful careers in the industry like Doug Parker, or David Cush, or Tom Horton, people like that.

 

Trish Regan:               Wow. That’s a pretty impressive group. You guys have all really done some amazing stuff. Think about the early ’80s and you think about now, how different does it seem, does it feel? The airline industry itself.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Yeah, it’s totally different now. The world continues to change, and one of the things that’s great about the airline industry as a career I think, is that every five or 10 years, the industry is new and different and there are new challenges. So it’s not like you learned it in your done, the success of the ’80s didn’t pretend success in the ’90s.

If you’re good in the ’90s, that said nothing about how you’re going to be when oil prices went up. And obviously when COVID hit that was a brand-new challenge for airline leaders have to realize. And airlines are still figuring out what the long-term impacts of that are going to be, what the structural changes of business traffic may be, and all the implications of that.

 

Trish Regan:               Working in the finance department, there are so many different components, and you think about what you would have to do as an airline to hedge out oil prices. And you got to hope that your guys and girls are getting it right in terms of oil prices because if it goes way down you’re going to be like, “Wait a second, why did I just buy all those oil futures at however many dollars a barrel?” I think that that’s going to be a pretty challenging space. There’s so much you have to do aside from just running an airline.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, that’s right. And fuel hedging is an interesting game that some of the biggest airlines have decided not to do it. If you sell a ticket today, that customer is likely traveling within the next 90 days, sometimes even sooner. And so what you’re really doing is locking in the fuel price for that short period because if I sell you a ticket today for a flight in a month from now, I can’t ask you for more money if my fuel cost goes up in that time. Beyond that time, airlines can adjust capacity, they can adjust prices and things.

So the need to hedge fuel prices out long term, that’s largely gone away from the industry. It’s only the airlines that are at risk of going out of business because they’ve run out of cash that might need to do something like that. But most airlines now just recognize that their fuel risk is really only a 60- or 90-day problem.

 

Trish Regan:               OK, so here’s the question that everybody wants the answer to, and you probably get asked this all the time. I’ve waited a bit because I want to get through some of the news of the moment. Those darn airline prices, the way they change constantly, is there an algorithm to try and figure out when is the best time to buy a ticket?

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, I don’t know if there’s a perfect algorithm but there’s one smart way to think about it, I think. Far away from departure, meaning a long time before departure, there’s not really an incentive for an airline to lower the price too much because they don’t really know what the demand for that flight is going be yet. They have estimates, of course, and things, but they don’t know what’s really going to happen, and you can always sell that seat for cheap.

There’s no reason to sell it cheap real early because then you might learn later on, “Well, there was very strong demand for this flight and I already sold too much of my product too cheaply.” So far out from departure for domestic flights, all of those decisions are usually made by a computer system in a department called yield management or revenue management.

The right time to think about buying a trip domestically is sometime between three and five weeks before departure. And the reason I say that is because that’s when it’s close enough that human beings are looking at it, and a human being might say, “I’m looking at the forecast for the flight and we should be booked at 60% to go out full in five weeks, but we’re only booked at 40%. We need to run a sale to build up that load.”

And they would not make that decision four months out, but they might make that decision three weeks out. So that’s why that time frame is the right time to buy because likely that’s when you’re going to get the lowest possible fares. Doesn’t mean it always works that way but buying further out doesn’t help. And sometimes, if you wait to get too close in while the plane’s too full now and they have no reason to lower the fare anymore.

 

Trish Regan:               Here’s another question for you. So I have noticed, if I go on to Expedia or one or these package-deal places, if you try and book your flight and you book your hotel together, even if it’s just for one or two nights in a hotel, your rates get drastically reduced. And this is, by the way, no matter your class of service. I saw a flight on American Airlines to Buenos Aires, Argentina, and a business class ticket would cost $4,500 to and from. But if you booked it with the Four Seasons hotel for a couple of nights, it suddenly plummeted to $1,800. Explain that one to me, Ben.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, that’s a real interesting one. Here’s why. If an airline publishes a fare, by publishes I mean it’s available that you and I can both see, then there’s all kinds of competitive pressure. If Delta Airlines sees that American Airlines is selling the plate for $100 on a flight they choose, Delta is likely to match that flight and everybody gets a lower price than they would otherwise get.

But when you buy a package, all of the prices are obscured. You don’t know when your package price – how much you’re paying for the airline versus the Four Seasons in your example. So, the hotel can offer a rate in that package that they wouldn’t offer on their website, and the airline will offer rates to that package that they won’t offer to the public.

 

Trish Regan:               Well, I would also make this point even I’ve seen this all over the country, Orlando, Vegas, if you combine it with the hotel, you get a totally different rate, and, as you said, both the hotel and the airline itself can hide behind that not really knowing what’s what. So do they work together? How do those things happen? Is that Expedia that packages it with them or do airlines have deals with hotels?

 

Ben Baldanza:            Some airlines had deals with hotels but what they will all do is have an arrangement with Expedia that they will talk about a package price that’s different than a published price. So you can show the world that I’ll sell this price for “X” but if your bundling is part of a package, you can sell it for this lower price… but no one ever sees that I offered that price. And the hotels do the same thing with them. So Expedia puts all that together.

Also, Expedia makes a lot more money when they sell a hotel than an airline because hotels pay much higher commissions than airlines do. So, Expedia has an incentive to create the package because they make more money in commissions when they can bundle a hotel room with a flight. You may notice that on many sites, the default when you go on is the hotel, not the flight, and that’s why.

 

Trish Regan:               So interesting. It really is. Removing some of that mystery is partly, though, what consumers want, which is – I’m not sure if Spirit did it, I’m pretty familiar with JetBlue… they definitely did it right – they had all those prices out on the open for you to see. They do have a deal with Expedia as well, I believe, but that transparency is certainly craved. If you were to fast forward, say five years, are there airlines that you would say, “These are the winners and these are the ones that are more challenged”?

 

Ben Baldanza:            The ones that are the most challenged are the biggest airlines that rely on business travel, which are American, United, Delta and surprisingly, Southwest is also in that group. And the biggest winners in the space are going to be the more leisure-focused, lower-cost airlines like the JetBlue, or a Spirit, or Frontier. And you will see this in the market shares too. Just a couple of years ago the four largest airlines in the U.S. carry 80% of all the traffic. Today, that number is down to 65% and it’s going to get lower over time because it’s the lower-cost carriers that are growing faster and gaining more and more share of all the travelers.

 

Trish Regan:               That makes sense. This has been such an interesting conversation. I want to tell you how much I appreciate you coming on and I now know, three to five weeks before departure that’s the sweet spot and to look for the package deal.

 

Ben Baldanza:            Well, thank you so much. It’s been great talking to you, and you’ve had great questions. So thank you very much.

 

Trish Regan:               Ben Baldanza, really great to have you here. Just a quick reminder to everyone, I’ve written on the airlines myself for American Consequences, americanconsequences.com. I’ve been pretty bullish throughout on JetBlue airlines, which may reflect my own personal bias because I like the airline so much, as well as Delta. I do like Delta too. They have tremendous customer service. Though Delta is going run certain risks, as Ben pointed out, given that it’s such a big airline that has been so dependent on business travel. But I do think that there’s opportunity in this space. I think consumers – they want to get out, they want to spend, they want to travel. And they may not be able to do it all over the world, but they do want to go places domestically.

So it’s worth taking a look at some of these airlines that he just mentioned, as we just discussed… JetBlue, Spirit, Frontier, some of these leisure-focused airlines. David Nielsen’s airline that just came out recently is worth keeping an eye on because this is a company that’s led by a man who’s just been a real legend in the industry – he created, of course, JetBlue. There will be some changes but there will be some opportunities, keep that in mind.

And consumer spending, I do believe, is going to continue to swell because people, they have a little bit more money right now and they’re going to have more in the future. I mean, look, unemployment is really low at new record lows. And consequently, what that tells you is that people aren’t feeling like they need to go back out and work again, now part of that maybe all the COVID stimulus.

But at some point, that runs out. And at some point, people want to go back to work again because they want to go and travel again and they want to buy stuff again. And though they’ve been doing it already, there’s an opportunity for them to do it even more. And so that’s why I still think that this is worth focusing on, especially at a time when no one else wants these companies.

Anyway, I wrote on this on americanconsequences.com. I encourage you to go to the website and check out all of my writings there. I encourage you to make sure that you have subscribed to this show if you haven’t on Apple, iTunes, Spotify, wherever you get your podcasts, and I’ll be right back here with you next week.

 

Recorded Voice:         Thank you for listening to this episode of American Consequences. Want more Trish? Read our weekly articles, Thursdays, in our magazine and americanconsequences.com, and subscribe for free to get all of our daily articles and the monthly magazine.

We’d love to hear from you too. Send Trish a note, [email protected] This broadcast is for entertainment purposes only and should not be considered personalized investment advice. Trading stocks and all other financial instruments involves risk. You should not make any investment decision based solely on what you hear. Trish Reagan’s American Consequences is produced by Stansberry Research and American Consequences, and is copyrighted by the Stansberry Radio Network.

 

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